I will agree that at times the defensive effort has been disappointing, but the expectations on here for a new coaching staff and a team cobbled together in 1 1/2 months that lost its leading scorer and point guard are just ridiculous.
And High Point is a good team with a lot of talent. They would challenge for the MVC Championship.
Once Elliott went down, I no longer had hopes/expectations that SIU could still somehow compete near the top of the MVC. I'd only hoped for improvement and to be a team nobody wants to play in St. Louis. However, it does not look like that's where we're heading.
What I'm unhappy with is, as you've stated, the lack of defensive effort that seems to show up every game. Going under ball screens (and still giving up layups), not closing off baselines, or closing out hard on shooters and folding like cheap suits in the paint on any decent post entry is a hard, hard watch and won't win over many fans.
--Insert something witty here--
I’ve never been an “apologist” but I’m with Woogers on this one. I respect Nagy’s decision not to raid his former team. I also think things will be different once he’s able to assemble a team of his own players, not ones he signed out of desperation. This is a conversation for 2-3 years from now. The guy had a month and a half to assemble a coaching staff and a team. Then he lost his best player for the season. Give him a break.
I will agree that at times the defensive effort has been disappointing, but the expectations on here for a new coaching staff and a team cobbled together in 1 1/2 months that lost its leading scorer and point guard are just ridiculous.
And High Point is a good team with a lot of talent. They would challenge for the MVC Championship.
With all do respect, having a team in the top 150 (or even 200, which we aren’t) isn’t all that crazy to expect, weather EE is here or not. And we aren’t just losing… we’re getting ran out of our own gym by double digits anytime someone decent comes in here. We barely handled USI at home, who is awful. I am legitimately afraid that Evansville has a shot here on New Year’s Day, and they are one of the worst teams in the country.
I don't think Nagy doesn't care. This was a team put together at the last second just to field a roster and not how Nagy really wants to build. We have 2 good high school recruits coming in including the frontrunner right now for Missouri Mr. Basketball. I want results now but this needs more than a year.
I am not against Nagy but the excuse that this is a new roster doesn't really hold. That is a lot of rosters now. Drakes coach was hired after Nagy and returned a similar amount of players. You could argue that this is because he brought some players with him but they were D2 players so that is quite risky(and two of them are grad transfers in their mid 20s).
Due to the portal and NIL even teams with longtime coaches are building new rosters every year. This isn't something that can be used as a crutch anymore, as teams are being built on the fly from the ground up and competing.
Drake's not a good comparison because most of their roster followed their coach. Nagy didn't bring anyone with him from Wright State.
The McCollum/Drake comparison clearly is a nonstarter this season (and by the way, I respect Nagy's decision not to poach anyone from Wright State unless you count Webber switching schools; still hoping he and Bey develop down the road). What we all should hope for now is a timeline similar to what Schertz had at Indiana State. What is sometimes forgotten is that Schertz went 11-20 (4-14 and ninth place in the Valley) in his first season in Terre Haute, so he was not as much of an overnight success as people might think. But in Year 2, the Sycamores added some talent and jumped to 23 wins while playing up-tempo, crowd-pleasing basketball. I'm not sure Nagy can pull something like that off next season -- a lot depends on who SIU loses in the transfer portal, and does he bring in the right replacements? On the other hand, I'm not convinced that he can't.
4 players followed and one barely plays. 2 were grad transfers who were going to try their brand at D1 for a year anyway.
Even with 4 that isn't even 1/3 of their current roster. Not "most".
Nagy also could have done that. He REFUSED to try and bring any players.
He handcuffed himself.
Wrong. The 4 starters who play the most minutes are all from NW Mo St.
The other starter is a Wyoming transfer.
Overall Individual Statistics
Player GP GS Minutes Mins/game PPG
Stirtz, Bennett 11 11 414 37.6 17.5 NWMS
Mascari, Mitch 11 11 390 35.5 12.5 NWMS
Abreu, Daniel 11 11 365 33.2 12.4 NWMS
Jackson, Isaiah 11 11 299 27.2 5.1 NWMS
Manyawu, Cam 11 11 231 21.0 10.4 Wyo transfer
Banks, Tavion 10 0 178 17.8 9.1 JC transfer
Numbers don't lie. He brought his excellent D2 team with him and they play the bulk of minutes. Two guys back from last year who barely play, three transfers, two of which get some minutes, and a freshman who barely plays.
The leading scorer is the Jr. from NWMS who was Freshman of the Year in that conference and 2nd team all-con last year, Bennett Stirtz.
Yes he got some help from a couple of guys in the the portal but mostly is just playing the guys who have played for him for years. So quit acting like he's a miracle worker who built this really good team from a bunch of guys who never played together. Just not true.
I'm betting Drake won't be as good next year when the three grad student starters are gone.
Everyone has an opinion about rosters and how they are put together but that is an argument for another day but if your head coach talks about how good a defensive team this year's team is going to be and in my opinion they lack basic fundamentals and effort that is a bigger problem than the roster assembly also the scheme seems to be lacking as this team goes under screens which allows wide open 3s which can't happen in today's game as offenses are built to shoot 3s except for this year's addition of the Salukis who can't shoot them
I will agree that at times the defensive effort has been disappointing, but the expectations on here for a new coaching staff and a team cobbled together in 1 1/2 months that lost its leading scorer and point guard are just ridiculous.
And High Point is a good team with a lot of talent. They would challenge for the MVC Championship.
With all do respect, having a team in the top 150 (or even 200, which we aren’t) isn’t all that crazy to expect, weather EE is here or not. And we aren’t just losing… we’re getting ran out of our own gym by double digits anytime someone decent comes in here. We barely handled USI at home, who is awful. I am legitimately afraid that Evansville has a shot here on New Year’s Day, and they are one of the worst teams in the country.
Take Marcus Domask away from a Mullins team for a whole season and see what you got. Losing your best playmaker/leading scorer/spark plug can really damage a team.
Also, getting bent out of shape losing to a good HP team when Davis obviously wasn't 100% is silly. HP also shot 57% - that's hard to beat. They're shooting 49% and 35% threes for the season.
It's still early. We'll get better but I think we're headed for the bottom three without Eliott. He was the only guy besides Dibba and maybe Davis who could consistently hit the outside shot.
It's year 1 with a team of mostly basketball vagabonds - no disrespect to the players. I don't expect much.
Uck Fevansville! We'll whip them if everyone's healthy.
At UNI on the 29th is going to be ugly.
4 players followed and one barely plays. 2 were grad transfers who were going to try their brand at D1 for a year anyway.
Even with 4 that isn't even 1/3 of their current roster. Not "most".
Nagy also could have done that. He REFUSED to try and bring any players.
He handcuffed himself.
Wrong. The 4 starters who play the most minutes are all from NW Mo St.
The other starter is a Wyoming transfer.
Overall Individual Statistics
Player GP GS Minutes Mins/game PPG
Stirtz, Bennett 11 11 414 37.6 17.5 NWMS
Mascari, Mitch 11 11 390 35.5 12.5 NWMS
Abreu, Daniel 11 11 365 33.2 12.4 NWMS
Jackson, Isaiah 11 11 299 27.2 5.1 NWMSManyawu, Cam 11 11 231 21.0 10.4 Wyo transfer
Banks, Tavion 10 0 178 17.8 9.1 JC transfer
Numbers don't lie. He brought his excellent D2 team with him and they play the bulk of minutes. Two guys back from last year who barely play, three transfers, two of which get some minutes, and a freshman who barely plays.
The leading scorer is the Jr. from NWMS who was Freshman of the Year in that conference and 2nd team all-con last year, Bennett Stirtz.
Yes he got some help from a couple of guys in the the portal but mostly is just playing the guys who have played for him for years. So quit acting like he's a miracle worker who built this really good team from a bunch of guys who never played together. Just not true.
I'm betting Drake won't be as good next year when the three grad student starters are gone.
I more misworded than was wrong. Isiah Jackson is the one I left out because he just isn't very good and probably should have stayed at the D2 level.
He didn't have to actively try to bring players with him but I'd much rather have AJ Braun(who left for CBU) than fucking Moreno.
I surely did not expect to beat a High Point team that will most likely be in the NCAA tournament this year. View their schedule, they have scored a lot of points this season. Even with EE we probably lose by 8-10 points.
I must add this. Coach Hinson had 7 years, Coach Mullins 5. There was a definite need for change in the end for both. If memory serves me, I don't believe those coaches won any MVC titles in their first year at SIU. Coach Nagy won't either. Patience is a virtue. He's going to get it done. If this was year 7 or 5 for Coach Nagy, complaints would be warranted. It's year number 1. He's an old school coach, and wants to build his team, and this program the right way. Total respect from me choosing not to take players with him from Wright State. Left his top assistant with a full cupboard. For those folks that say he is coasting toward retirement, and implying he is done, or has no interest, shame on you. From what I have seen and listened to via Saluki sports media, Coach Nagy is a professional. Saying he's coasting because of salary is unfair, and just plain silly.
Go Coach Nagy, GO DAWGS!!!
I surely did not expect to beat a High Point team that will most likely be in the NCAA tournament this year. View their schedule, they have scored a lot of points this season. Even with EE we probably lose by 8-10 points.
I must add this. Coach Hinson had 7 years, Coach Mullins 5. There was a definite need for change in the end for both. If memory serves me, I don't believe those coaches won any MVC titles in their first year at SIU. Coach Nagy won't either. Patience is a virtue. He's going to get it done. If this was year 7 or 5 for Coach Nagy, complaints would be warranted. It's year number 1. He's an old school coach, and wants to build his team, and this program the right way. Total respect from me choosing not to take players with him from Wright State. Left his top assistant with a full cupboard. For those folks that say he is coasting toward retirement, and implying he is done, or has no interest, shame on you. From what I have seen and listened to via Saluki sports media, Coach Nagy is a professional. Saying he's coasting because of salary is unfair, and just plain silly.
Go Coach Nagy, GO DAWGS!!!
Agree. Accusing Nagy of sliding towards retirement because he has a different (and more open) personality than the last coach is ridiculous. Talk about snap judgement. Different coaches approach the game and their game behavior in diverse ways. He's a couple of months into a new gig. Give the guy a chance!
I hope I am never around a coach “coasting” at the end of his career. I have never met one or been around one who did. In my opinion, coaches have too much pride and professionalism, not to mention ego, to do this.
I also agree that Coach Nagy showed great class in not pursuing any of his former players to come with him. That could have made for a truly ugly situation. He did bring his best recruit with him and I am sure there were some there not happy about that.
Obviously this has not been the season any of us wanted. Watching Coach Nagy, it has not been easy on him either. You can see the frustration in his expressions and actions. I’ll admit to being frustrated in the stands as well.
There are some things definitely needing improvement. Blaming the coach is not always the answer. These are 20+ year olds, not sixth graders. There are mistakes made that they should know better, both defensively and offensively. I can guarantee they have been told and are being told by the coaches.
My two cents worth on possible ideas. With the length we have, maybe play an odd-front zone like a 1-3-1. I also feel Moreno should be given a chance. I have watched him in his little playing time he has been given, and I have seen him play ball screens better than our other bigs. He deserves a chance especially with the way our bigs played Saturday.
In one of my posts about Nagy, I mentioned co-workers who "mailed it in" as they approached retirement. I must emphasize that in no way do I believe Nagy is in this category. Listened today to his postgame interview from the High Point game, and there's no way anyone lacking passion would be so hard on himself (if nothing else, I respect him for that because our previous few coaches haven't exactly been vocal about taking ownership for defeats and failures). Also, Nagy has a big challenge here -- to get this program back to the NCAA tournament or else. The administration has made that clear. Would he have uprooted himself in late middle age, along with his family, if he wasn't willing to work long and hard to accomplish that? Actually, I'm probably more concerned about some of the players mailing it in than I am Nagy if the losses pile up, but let's hope that's not the case.
In one of my posts about Nagy, I mentioned co-workers who "mailed it in" as they approached retirement. I must emphasize that in no way do I believe Nagy is in this category. Listened today to his postgame interview from the High Point game, and there's no way anyone lacking passion would be so hard on himself (if nothing else, I respect him for that because our previous few coaches haven't exactly been vocal about taking ownership for defeats and failures). Also, Nagy has a big challenge here -- to get this program back to the NCAA tournament or else. The administration has made that clear. Would he have uprooted himself in late middle age, along with his family, if he wasn't willing to work long and hard to accomplish that? Actually, I'm probably more concerned about some of the players mailing it in than I am Nagy if the losses pile up, but let's hope that's not the case.
Agree with this. Nagy has a proven track record and he and his staff are still in the infancy stages of working together. Can I nitpick a few of his coaching quirks? Sure, but I'm giving him a pass as he navigates whats been a tough situation since his first day on the job.
My beef is more with the players and not understanding what SIU basketball culture has been about. There were some expectations for this group going in because on paper there's some talent, but they aren't playing winning basketball. 1-5, there's no sense of urgency, particularly defensively. That's disturbing and tough to watch.
You can't coach effort ... while I have some issues with the validity of that claim, I do believe that if you have to spend a substantial amount of energy trying to coach it at this level, you've got problems, and your team isn't going to do much winning.
--Insert something witty here--
keep drinking the maroon kool aid. Will lose 20+ games this year.
keep drinking the maroon kool aid. Will lose 20+ games this year.
And that would be fine. It’s not about this season.
