Sorry but I have to respectfully disagree. Hill was originally hired at SIU because of his knowledge as a QB (QB coach). Therefore, it’s his job to recruit talented QBs that fit into his system and not be career backups. I find it hard to believe he recruited Lyle’s to be a backup QB. Sometimes you have to place blame where it’s deserved.
Agreed. The QB play under Hill has been disappointing and a big part of the woeful results.
Agree, the qb play should have been better under Nick. I was very disappointed with Sam Straub last year. A 5th year senior and a 3rd year starter. Played extremely poorly before his benching. I was told what the problem was, but I don't want to say it here because it's not positive and I can't be 100% it's accurate. Does anybody know, with 100% no doubt about it facts, what happened to Straub last year?
I'm not sayin' -- I'm just sayin'!
Under Hill, SIUs offense has been consistently one of the best in total yards; however, in my opinion, this sums up the real issue. If we could find previous years under Hill, SIUs ranking would be near the bottom as well.
| Red Zone | Touchdowns | Field Goals | Lost possession | ||||||||
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| RED ZONE OFFENSE | G | Scores-Chances | Pct. | TDs | Rush-Pass | Made-Att | Fumb | Int. | Downs | Other | |
| 1. | North Dakota St. | 5 | 21-22 | 95.5 | 17 | 11-6 | 4-4 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 0 |
| 2. | Youngstown State | 5 | 18-19 | 94.7 | 17 | 13-4 | 1-1 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 0 |
| 3. | Northern Iowa | 5 | 13-14 | 92.9 | 7 | 3-4 | 6-6 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1 |
| Illinois State | 5 | 13-14 | 92.9 | 7 | 5-2 | 6-6 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 0 | |
| 5. | Missouri State | 4 | 9-10 | 90.0 | 5 | 1-4 | 4-5 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 |
| 6. | Western Illinois | 5 | 8-10 | 80.0 | 5 | 4-1 | 3-4 | 0 | 1 | 0 | 0 |
| 7. | South Dakota St. | 5 | 17-22 | 77.3 | 14 | 10-4 | 3-4 | 2 | 0 | 0 | 2 |
| 8. | South Dakota | 5 | 12-16 | 75.0 | 9 | 4-5 | 3-5 | 1 | 0 | 1 | 0 |
| 9. | Southern Illinois | 5 | 13-19 | 68.4 | 12 | 9-3 | 1-2 | 0 | 2 | 2 | 1 |
| 10. | Indiana State | 5 | 12-18 | 66.7 | 7 | 6-1 | 5-7 | 0 | 1 | 1 | 2 |
FootballFan, all good arguments. And I can't really disagree with you. All fall on the negative side of the ledger. I guess what is really the bottom line for me is what Jerry Kill did. Or actually, what he didn't do. The Killer replaced so many coaches. All of whom were not successful. Some were controversial moves. And the Killer didn't really care what fall out was going to follow. Yet he keeps Nick. I trust the Killer's opinion much more than I trust anyone's on this board. Including mine. I know that for this logic to work, you have to be a Killer fan. Many on this board aren't. Obviously I am.
I'm not sayin' -- I'm just sayin'!
I guess I’m not sure what you mean regarding the moves that AD Kill made with this coaching regime. Typically it’s the head coach who brings in his assistants and the AD signs off. Is this not the case with Hill’s staff?
I guess I’m not sure what you mean regarding the moves that AD Kill made with this coaching regime. Typically it’s the head coach who brings in his assistants and the AD signs off. Is this not the case with Hill’s staff?
Kill didn't fire Hill. He could have, but chose to keep him. He hadn't given up on Hill yet. I haven't yet either.
I'm not sayin' -- I'm just sayin'!
I think its definitely time for Nick to be replaced. Has anyone heard any rumors on who might be coaching the Dawgs in 2020?
Nick. He's still under contract in 2020.
Sometimes you got to bite the bullet. Keeping a lame duck coach around for another year will kill recruiting. With the facilities we have now and everything SIU has to offer, this team should compete for conference titles on a regular basis. We haven't come close under Nick's leadership and nothing shows me things would change in a year's time. I loved Nick as QB but he's not the answer at head coach. It's sad to watch this same shit show week after week.
I respectfully disagree. Nick deserves more time. He doesn't have the background that Kill had when he came in and turned things around in three years. Kill was already an established head coach. This is Nick's first rodeo. He's still one of the youngest head coaches in D1. And look what Nick walked into. Dale 'the looser' Lennon was an absolute pigf..k as a coach. Had no business even getting an opportunity at this level. I guess he's a nice guy, but was completely out of his depth. And tell me how many programs, at any level, can continue at their best with a second string qb at the helm. Lyles sucks sideways. Holds the ball too long on quick routes because he knows his arm is inaccurate and can't fit it into a small window. Holds the ball too long on long routes because he knows his arm is so weak that he can't get the ball there unless his receiver is open by about 15 yards. Can't run. Has no escapability. I agree that Nick has to get something that resembles a defense. Is it really that tough recruiting a DT that isn't completely inept? Maybe they should switch to a 3-4 so we don't need as many. I say give Nick a two year extension. If at the end of that he hasn't got it figured out, then make a change.
This is the first game I've seen in person in two years. I assume Nick Hill will get his last year, but he wouldn't if I was AD. Sadly, four years is enough. This team is bad in about every aspect of the game. 6th game of the year and penalties and dumb, undisciplined mistakes abound like running kickoffs out of the endzone so we start at the 15 instead of the 25, etc. There's some talent here and there - not nearly enough, but this team is just poorly coached IMO. They could/should be better. I also didn't think much of the play calling for the most part.
Lyles has serious issues at QB. Bad mechanics, bad decisions, really bad timing, poor accuracy, poor awareness in the pocket. He consistently released the ball too late. Amazing he wasn't intercepted four or five times. Stone is way better IMO. I'd give Baker a chance at this point.
In Lyles defense, his protection wasn't great, but some of those many sacks were his fault.
I thought it was a big mistake to keep Lennon as long as we did. I hope we don't make that same mistake with Hill. Things have NOT improved since the Dale Lennon era. What a disappointment!
Sorry but I have to respectfully disagree. Hill was originally hired at SIU because of his knowledge as a QB (QB coach). Therefore, it’s his job to recruit talented QBs that fit into his system and not be career backups. I find it hard to believe he recruited Lyle’s to be a backup QB. Sometimes you have to place blame where it’s deserved.
You do understand that SIU is not ALABAMA or CLEMSON. You can't get everyone you want. Sometimes you simply have to settle with what you can get.
Of course. But settling I don’t get. Not in the MVFC. Not at the QB position. Not with the facilities and education that can be gained at SIU. Maybe quality QBs don’t want to play for him. Jussayin’
I think its definitely time for Nick to be replaced. Has anyone heard any rumors on who might be coaching the Dawgs in 2020?
Nick. He's still under contract in 2020.
Sometimes you got to bite the bullet. Keeping a lame duck coach around for another year will kill recruiting. With the facilities we have now and everything SIU has to offer, this team should compete for conference titles on a regular basis. We haven't come close under Nick's leadership and nothing shows me things would change in a year's time. I loved Nick as QB but he's not the answer at head coach. It's sad to watch this same shit show week after week.
I respectfully disagree. Nick deserves more time. He doesn't have the background that Kill had when he came in and turned things around in three years. Kill was already an established head coach. This is Nick's first rodeo. He's still one of the youngest head coaches in D1. And look what Nick walked into. Dale 'the looser' Lennon was an absolute pigf..k as a coach. Had no business even getting an opportunity at this level. I guess he's a nice guy, but was completely out of his depth. And tell me how many programs, at any level, can continue at their best with a second string qb at the helm. Lyles sucks sideways. Holds the ball too long on quick routes because he knows his arm is inaccurate and can't fit it into a small window. Holds the ball too long on long routes because he knows his arm is so weak that he can't get the ball there unless his receiver is open by about 15 yards. Can't run. Has no escapability. I agree that Nick has to get something that resembles a defense. Is it really that tough recruiting a DT that isn't completely inept? Maybe they should switch to a 3-4 so we don't need as many. I say give Nick a two year extension. If at the end of that he hasn't got it figured out, then make a change.
Dale needed to go but let’s not exaggerate how bad he was. His teams were almost always competitive, he just never got over the hump in the big games. The program has clearly taken a monster step back under Nick
I think its definitely time for Nick to be replaced. Has anyone heard any rumors on who might be coaching the Dawgs in 2020?
Nick. He's still under contract in 2020.
Sometimes you got to bite the bullet. Keeping a lame duck coach around for another year will kill recruiting. With the facilities we have now and everything SIU has to offer, this team should compete for conference titles on a regular basis. We haven't come close under Nick's leadership and nothing shows me things would change in a year's time. I loved Nick as QB but he's not the answer at head coach. It's sad to watch this same shit show week after week.
I respectfully disagree. Nick deserves more time. He doesn't have the background that Kill had when he came in and turned things around in three years. Kill was already an established head coach. This is Nick's first rodeo. He's still one of the youngest head coaches in D1. And look what Nick walked into. Dale 'the looser' Lennon was an absolute pigf..k as a coach. Had no business even getting an opportunity at this level. I guess he's a nice guy, but was completely out of his depth. And tell me how many programs, at any level, can continue at their best with a second string qb at the helm. Lyles sucks sideways. Holds the ball too long on quick routes because he knows his arm is inaccurate and can't fit it into a small window. Holds the ball too long on long routes because he knows his arm is so weak that he can't get the ball there unless his receiver is open by about 15 yards. Can't run. Has no escapability. I agree that Nick has to get something that resembles a defense. Is it really that tough recruiting a DT that isn't completely inept? Maybe they should switch to a 3-4 so we don't need as many. I say give Nick a two year extension. If at the end of that he hasn't got it figured out, then make a change.
Dale needed to go but let’s not exaggerate how bad he was. His teams were almost always competitive, he just never got over the hump in the big games. The program has clearly taken a monster step back under Nick
I read earlier this year that last year Nick lost five games by one score. That doesn't sound like a step back from Dale 'the loser' Lennon. Lennon had been a head coach for years before he got to SIU. And don't forget, Lennon took over a program that was a fixture in the playoffs and in top 10 rankings. Nick took over a team that had been turned into the doormat of the MVFC. And how many wins did Lennon have in his last year -- 2? Nick is a first time head coach and very young (as far as D1 head coaches go). I give him several years to start up the learning curve before I start grading. And again, if Jerry Kill didn't get rid of him, then Nick must be doing something right. If anybody knows football coaching, it's Kill. Nick's under contract through 2020. I would give him a couple year extension and see where he's at. I don't know anything about the new AD. But I'll go with Kill's opinion pertaining to football coaches over hers anyday.
I'm not sayin' -- I'm just sayin'!
Just finished watching the replay...errr most of it anyway. Offense looked terrible. Kare had his worst game so far. He was probably responsible for at least half the sacks because he held the ball too long. Made some pretty poor decisions with the ball albeit quite a few times on 3rd and long trying to make a play. He can be summed up by two plays back to back right before half. Throws a beautiful ball as they are driving before halftime between the corner and safety to set them up around the 15 and the very next play tries a hero throw on a post to Bonasinga that gets deflected and intercepted. I was pretty disappointed with his game and would not be surprised if Stone is back starting next week if healthy. He had 3 weeks to show he could win games but just didn’t pounce on the opportunity.
It has become somewhat of a trend for SIU to leave points on the field when they get to the red zone via turnovers or turnover on downs...Hill needs to fix this ASAP. I guess to be fair that fake field goal was a great call and should have been a TD...the throw was awful and one I wouldn’t expect from a qb even a backup.
Defense overall played well enough to win...looked really bad on the drives they gave up points on (huge chunk plays all the way down the field), but still only gave up 21. Some of that could be due to ISU just killing clock at the end. Overall though they kept us in the game and that’s more than you could say last year.
Very disappointing game and makes next week a must win if they plan to make the late October/early November games mean something this year.
I think its definitely time for Nick to be replaced. Has anyone heard any rumors on who might be coaching the Dawgs in 2020?
Nick. He's still under contract in 2020.
Sometimes you got to bite the bullet. Keeping a lame duck coach around for another year will kill recruiting. With the facilities we have now and everything SIU has to offer, this team should compete for conference titles on a regular basis. We haven't come close under Nick's leadership and nothing shows me things would change in a year's time. I loved Nick as QB but he's not the answer at head coach. It's sad to watch this same shit show week after week.
I respectfully disagree. Nick deserves more time. He doesn't have the background that Kill had when he came in and turned things around in three years. Kill was already an established head coach. This is Nick's first rodeo. He's still one of the youngest head coaches in D1. And look what Nick walked into. Dale 'the looser' Lennon was an absolute pigf..k as a coach. Had no business even getting an opportunity at this level. I guess he's a nice guy, but was completely out of his depth. And tell me how many programs, at any level, can continue at their best with a second string qb at the helm. Lyles sucks sideways. Holds the ball too long on quick routes because he knows his arm is inaccurate and can't fit it into a small window. Holds the ball too long on long routes because he knows his arm is so weak that he can't get the ball there unless his receiver is open by about 15 yards. Can't run. Has no escapability. I agree that Nick has to get something that resembles a defense. Is it really that tough recruiting a DT that isn't completely inept? Maybe they should switch to a 3-4 so we don't need as many. I say give Nick a two year extension. If at the end of that he hasn't got it figured out, then make a change.
Dale needed to go but let’s not exaggerate how bad he was. His teams were almost always competitive, he just never got over the hump in the big games. The program has clearly taken a monster step back under Nick
I read earlier this year that last year Nick lost five games by one score. That doesn't sound like a step back from Dale 'the loser' Lennon. Lennon had been a head coach for years before he got to SIU. And don't forget, Lennon took over a program that was a fixture in the playoffs and in top 10 rankings. Nick took over a team that had been turned into the doormat of the MVFC. And how many wins did Lennon have in his last year -- 2? Nick is a first time head coach and very young (as far as D1 head coaches go). I give him several years to start up the learning curve before I start grading. And again, if Jerry Kill didn't get rid of him, then Nick must be doing something right. If anybody knows football coaching, it's Kill. Nick's under contract through 2020. I would give him a couple year extension and see where he's at. I don't know anything about the new AD. But I'll go with Kill's opinion pertaining to football coaches over hers anyday.
I was all for getting rid of Dale as well. However, he was working with one of the worst facilities in college football when he arrived. The university has invested in a new stadium which is top of the line for FCS programs. It needs to get a return on this investment and the lack of inter st in the program is preventing that. Look at this thread for evidence. For a game against our biggest in state rival, it’s got 2 pages of game discussion (not counting the Nick Hill content in that). If we are to sell more tickets and get more donors, we have to stop losing and nothing going on now shows me this is about to happen.
I think its definitely time for Nick to be replaced. Has anyone heard any rumors on who might be coaching the Dawgs in 2020?
Nick. He's still under contract in 2020.
Sometimes you got to bite the bullet. Keeping a lame duck coach around for another year will kill recruiting. With the facilities we have now and everything SIU has to offer, this team should compete for conference titles on a regular basis. We haven't come close under Nick's leadership and nothing shows me things would change in a year's time. I loved Nick as QB but he's not the answer at head coach. It's sad to watch this same shit show week after week.
I respectfully disagree. Nick deserves more time. He doesn't have the background that Kill had when he came in and turned things around in three years. Kill was already an established head coach. This is Nick's first rodeo. He's still one of the youngest head coaches in D1. And look what Nick walked into. Dale 'the looser' Lennon was an absolute pigf..k as a coach. Had no business even getting an opportunity at this level. I guess he's a nice guy, but was completely out of his depth. And tell me how many programs, at any level, can continue at their best with a second string qb at the helm. Lyles sucks sideways. Holds the ball too long on quick routes because he knows his arm is inaccurate and can't fit it into a small window. Holds the ball too long on long routes because he knows his arm is so weak that he can't get the ball there unless his receiver is open by about 15 yards. Can't run. Has no escapability. I agree that Nick has to get something that resembles a defense. Is it really that tough recruiting a DT that isn't completely inept? Maybe they should switch to a 3-4 so we don't need as many. I say give Nick a two year extension. If at the end of that he hasn't got it figured out, then make a change.
Dale needed to go but let’s not exaggerate how bad he was. His teams were almost always competitive, he just never got over the hump in the big games. The program has clearly taken a monster step back under Nick
I read earlier this year that last year Nick lost five games by one score. That doesn't sound like a step back from Dale 'the loser' Lennon. Lennon had been a head coach for years before he got to SIU. And don't forget, Lennon took over a program that was a fixture in the playoffs and in top 10 rankings. Nick took over a team that had been turned into the doormat of the MVFC. And how many wins did Lennon have in his last year -- 2? Nick is a first time head coach and very young (as far as D1 head coaches go). I give him several years to start up the learning curve before I start grading. And again, if Jerry Kill didn't get rid of him, then Nick must be doing something right. If anybody knows football coaching, it's Kill. Nick's under contract through 2020. I would give him a couple year extension and see where he's at. I don't know anything about the new AD. But I'll go with Kill's opinion pertaining to football coaches over hers anyday.
Not a good argument. Just because Kill didn’t make a move just three years in doesn’t mean he wouldn’t have after Year 4 or Year 5, especially with no signs of progress. Not to mention the personal relationship the two have that could have clouded judgment.
Hard to disagree with the arguments, pro and con, about this team and Nick. I'm not quite there yet about a new coach and think one more year is needed. The remaining games will also be an indicator of their progress. It's not so much the losses, as much as it is how, SIU loses. A strong finish should, theoretically, help next year.
Clearly though, the QB situation has to be addressed. That was just painful to watch.
March on triumphantly!
Just finished watching the replay...errr most of it anyway. Offense looked terrible. Kare had his worst game so far. He was probably responsible for at least half the sacks because he held the ball too long. Made some pretty poor decisions with the ball albeit quite a few times on 3rd and long trying to make a play. He can be summed up by two plays back to back right before half. Throws a beautiful ball as they are driving before halftime between the corner and safety to set them up around the 15 and the very next play tries a hero throw on a post to Bonasinga that gets deflected and intercepted. I was pretty disappointed with his game and would not be surprised if Stone is back starting next week if healthy. He had 3 weeks to show he could win games but just didn’t pounce on the opportunity.
It has become somewhat of a trend for SIU to leave points on the field when they get to the red zone via turnovers or turnover on downs...Hill needs to fix this ASAP. I guess to be fair that fake field goal was a great call and should have been a TD...the throw was awful and one I wouldn’t expect from a qb even a backup.
Defense overall played well enough to win...looked really bad on the drives they gave up points on (huge chunk plays all the way down the field), but still only gave up 21. Some of that could be due to ISU just killing clock at the end. Overall though they kept us in the game and that’s more than you could say last year.
Very disappointing game and makes next week a must win if they plan to make the late October/early November games mean something this year.
There were a couple of great plays by Dbacks - reminded me of Terry Taylor way back when. However, for the most part the DBs gave waaaaayyyy tooo much cushion, allowing Brady Davis to make easy completions. That's not great coaching.
I would be shocked if we beat the Penguins. They're not bad. Looking down the road, we may have a hard time winning two more games.
Is Stone out for the year or could he come back soon? He had looked good this year before the injury, and he’s only a sophomore.
Regarding Nick Hill, he seems to be recruiting well for the most part, but the on-field product looks inconsistent and very sloppy at times. I think he deserves another year given how young he is, and we probably can’t afford to fire him anyway. He’s also working on a cheap contract. The defense looks improved but you expect the offense to be dominant under Hill.
