No one wants to answer this question but I'll try.
1. Shores up complete MVC ownership of that tri-state area with SIU and Evansville. Yes, I know there's not a huge population, but it builds much needed rivalries between the colleges.
2. Agriculture academic dominance. Farmers kids will have additional choices on where to attend school if they pursue that academic area. Maybe it will encourage SIU's admin to put more money into our Agg program to continually recruit students from the tri-state area.
3. Academically, Murray State fits in with the MVC publics with an average ACT scores of 21-28. Indiana State has the lowest range for both ACT/SAT and an insanely high acceptance rate. SIU is now a mind blowing 66% compared to everyone else at 82% (90% for Indiana State.
4. Enrollment is around 6,200 students that would put them in the middle of MVC schools as a whole.
5. Campus culture is high. When I partied there for a night in college, I thought it was pretty cool that they had those custom shields on every building, and students actually seemed to care about the college they went to.
6. Graduation rate at Murray State is higher then SIU, and Indiana State. Also higher then Texas-Arlington. So miss me with low graduation rates...
7. They are embarking on a large scale athletics renovation plan. Finally upgrading key pieces to campus to maintain MVC standards unlike a Northern Indiana school.
The only negative I see of having Murray State in the MVC is that they will be a middle to bottom of the pack program outside of MBB. Here are there records since 2016.
Men's Basketball: 10-5
Baseball: 10-13
Softball: 10-14
Women's basketball: 4-6
Volleyball: 3-4
Women's Soccer: 3-2
From an SIU prospective, I now see why the admin wants to keep them out. Mostly to protect our recruiting interests for non-liberal art programs.
Murray also has one of the very best equine programs in the country. If you like horsies, that's a plus! I know young people from central Illinois who have gone to Murray just for that program.
Also they have been very good in college bass fishing! That's very important to anglers everywhere. LOL
Loyola sucked in everything but men's vb when they joined! They upped their game. Sportswise, I don't think Murray is much different than Indiana State and is better than Valpo or Evansville. Maybe not as good in baseball but typically far better in basketball and probably dead even in football with ISU (and WIU). (If you had the misfortune to see Valpo's softball team last year, one of the worst D1 softball teams ever - embarrassingly bad.) Evansville's basketball program has been terrible for years. (other than that once a century anomaly of beating Kentucky last year)
I think it would be a great rivalry for SIU and spur our basketball program to improve, because it's been mediocre for years.
I'm not propping them up to become a fan of Murray State. I'm propping them up because they add value athletically. I was trying put together a reason why they fit academically.
This was the source I used to compare MVC Public schools and them.
Twitter: CPTNDONUTS
Former WIDB Sports Director and Dawg Pound President. Since my freshmen year, SIU Basketball has not appeared in a NCAA or NIT postseason game.
SIU graduation rate: 62%
Meth U graduation rate: 38%
you are posting fake news sir
Okay Valpo has struggled in the Valley no doubt. But I believe part of the reason they were added was the private to public balance the privates wanted. I just can't get excited to add UT-A and their one NCAA appearance and UIC and their 3 appearances. I get the UIC talk Chicago is very important to a lot of Valley schools and SIU but UT-A ? What are better options for the Valley to add? I am certain that more than UIC will be added, just not excited about ANY of the other choices mentioned. Really have a feeling it will be UT-Arlington ugh
How, oh how, has a powerhouse school like Murray, who has been to the NCAAs SEVENTEEN freaking times, who always has NBA superstars on their rosters, whose fanbase is rivaled only by the North Carolinas, and the Dukes, not once, not even once, made it to the Sweet Sixteen, when virtually every team in the MVC has accomplished that, and some more? Oh, wait! They have been stuck in OVC Hell forever, amazing that some astute conference has not begged them to join them. People must be blind I suppose. BTW- did anyone ever answer Barkeeps question? And, when is Murray going to add Catfishing as a major?
The advancement and diffusion of knowledge is the only guardian of true liberty.
James Madison
I'm not propping them up to become a fan of Murray State. I'm propping them up because they add value athletically. I was trying put together a reason why they fit academically.
This was the source I used to compare MVC Public schools and them.
thank you for the citation front row. their numbers don't match up with the us department of education, but that's why i ask about criteria. some use 4 year grad, some 5 year, some 6 year, some even 8. enrollment seems to be the same kind of moving target.
Craving a McBride Special!
Okay Valpo has struggled in the Valley no doubt. But I believe part of the reason they were added was the private to public balance the privates wanted. I just can't get excited to add UT-A and their one NCAA appearance and UIC and their 3 appearances. I get the UIC talk Chicago is very important to a lot of Valley schools and SIU but UT-A ? What are better options for the Valley to add? I am certain that more than UIC will be added, just not excited about ANY of the other choices mentioned. Really have a feeling it will be UT-Arlington ugh
is the balance thing still something that is considered? every school invited to present are public. i don't know either way. if it is still a thing then that points to uic being the only invite here and any future round being a private. 11 works just fine.
Craving a McBride Special!
Okay Valpo has struggled in the Valley no doubt. But I believe part of the reason they were added was the private to public balance the privates wanted. I just can't get excited to add UT-A and their one NCAA appearance and UIC and their 3 appearances. I get the UIC talk Chicago is very important to a lot of Valley schools and SIU but UT-A ? What are better options for the Valley to add? I am certain that more than UIC will be added, just not excited about ANY of the other choices mentioned. Really have a feeling it will be UT-Arlington ugh
In the article (I think from the SunTimes) writer stated that the commish was interested in UTA. I agree with you - bad idea. Too far away, no sports tradition, no fan base, still largely a commuter school located between Ft. Worth and Dallas. The will add nothing to Arch Madness, which I think is far more important to the MVC than some on here think.
I'm not crazy about UIC for the same reasons - not much sports tradition, mostly a commuter school, no fan base... but it's in a huge city in Illinois and will give the MVC a lot of exposure in the Chicago media I think, especially if they improve their athletic programs. Therefore it's a must have.
The public/private balance is out the window hopefully. This is an athletic, non-academic conference and that balance should mean nothing. Wouldn't surprise me if some MVC Prezs are pushing Lipscomb.
How, oh how, has a powerhouse school like Murray, who has been to the NCAAs SEVENTEEN freaking times, who always has NBA superstars on their rosters, whose fanbase is rivaled only by the North Carolinas, and the Dukes, not once, not even once, made it to the Sweet Sixteen, when virtually every team in the MVC has accomplished that, and some more? Oh, wait! They have been stuck in OVC Hell forever, amazing that some astute conference has not begged them to join them. People must be blind I suppose.
Creighton never made it to the Sweet 16 while they were in the Valley, yet for some reason the Big East decided they were a worthwhile basketball program to send an invitation to.
How, oh how, has a powerhouse school like Murray, who has been to the NCAAs SEVENTEEN freaking times, who always has NBA superstars on their rosters, whose fanbase is rivaled only by the North Carolinas, and the Dukes, not once, not even once, made it to the Sweet Sixteen, when virtually every team in the MVC has accomplished that, and some more? Oh, wait! They have been stuck in OVC Hell forever, amazing that some astute conference has not begged them to join them. People must be blind I suppose.
Creighton never made it to the Sweet 16 while they were in the Valley, yet for some reason the Big East decided they were a worthwhile basketball program to send an invitation to.
Well, a couple of things....like minded institutions(7 Catholic Universities)... other quality programs...no football , high academics,and guess what ? Omaha is a major t.v. market......think Murray from the OVC is a bit different than Creighton from the MVC...oh and just for facts sake they made it in 1974 and at least one other time prior.
How, oh how, has a powerhouse school like Murray, who has been to the NCAAs SEVENTEEN freaking times, who always has NBA superstars on their rosters, whose fanbase is rivaled only by the North Carolinas, and the Dukes, not once, not even once, made it to the Sweet Sixteen, when virtually every team in the MVC has accomplished that, and some more? Oh, wait! They have been stuck in OVC Hell forever, amazing that some astute conference has not begged them to join them. People must be blind I suppose.
Creighton never made it to the Sweet 16 while they were in the Valley, yet for some reason the Big East decided they were a worthwhile basketball program to send an invitation to.
swing and a miss, marine.
Craving a McBride Special!
1/2/2022 NET ratings
#18 Loyola
#36 Belmont
#46 Murray St
#53 Creighton
#71 SLU
#77 Wichita
#87 Drake
#89 Mo St
#132 Bradley
#144 UNI
#165 SIU
#167 Ind. St
#186 Valpo
#211 ISU
#295 SEMO
#296 Evansville
How, oh how, has a powerhouse school like Murray, who has been to the NCAAs SEVENTEEN freaking times, who always has NBA superstars on their rosters, whose fanbase is rivaled only by the North Carolinas, and the Dukes, not once, not even once, made it to the Sweet Sixteen, when virtually every team in the MVC has accomplished that, and some more? Oh, wait! They have been stuck in OVC Hell forever, amazing that some astute conference has not begged them to join them. People must be blind I suppose.
Creighton never made it to the Sweet 16 while they were in the Valley, yet for some reason the Big East decided they were a worthwhile basketball program to send an invitation to.
Well, a couple of things....like minded institutions(7 Catholic Universities)... other quality programs...no football , high academics,and guess what ? Omaha is a major t.v. market......think Murray from the OVC is a bit different than Creighton from the MVC...oh and just for facts sake they made it in 1974 and at least one other time prior.
So you're saying the Big East grabbed a school in Nebraska mainly because they last went to the Sweet 16 - which is before the tourny expanded to 64 teams and therefore easier to reach - 30 years before the invite? You don't think Creighton's sustained success for years in the non con and at the top of the Valley was a bigger reason? Why did Dana Altman land a job at Oregon then? Shouldn't they have laughed at him and said sorry Dana, you never made it to the Sweet 16? Yes, those milestones in March Madness are important, but to use that as an argument that Murray "isn't good enough" is an interesting choice.
Like minded institutions: Murray is a pretty like minded institution to the public school template in the Valley. Also, Murray to the Valley is a conference upgrade just like the Valley to the Big East.
The anti Murray argument is fine, but if one goes that route than there literally is not a school out there that is worthy from a basketball perspective at least at the Valley level or below since programs never downgrade conferences.
Ok, so using that logic.....a particular moment in time...Fla St, Kan St, Virginia,Louisville, Indiana, Creighton, Wichita etc. etc. should be considered less than Murray? So should the Big East, The ACC, The Big Ten etc be asking Murray to join? Of course not...its one marker , about the only one , and its one moment in time. And im not even a Murray hater but these singular arguments arent really helping your cause. They have a good program, and if they get in I'm not gonna lose any sleep or jump for joy....but its not like they're Xavier, or Richmond or Dayton....its Murray.
How, oh how, has a powerhouse school like Murray, who has been to the NCAAs SEVENTEEN freaking times, who always has NBA superstars on their rosters, whose fanbase is rivaled only by the North Carolinas, and the Dukes, not once, not even once, made it to the Sweet Sixteen, when virtually every team in the MVC has accomplished that, and some more? Oh, wait! They have been stuck in OVC Hell forever, amazing that some astute conference has not begged them to join them. People must be blind I suppose.
Creighton never made it to the Sweet 16 while they were in the Valley, yet for some reason the Big East decided they were a worthwhile basketball program to send an invitation to.
Well, a couple of things....like minded institutions(7 Catholic Universities)... other quality programs...no football , high academics,and guess what ? Omaha is a major t.v. market......think Murray from the OVC is a bit different than Creighton from the MVC...oh and just for facts sake they made it in 1974 and at least one other time prior.
So you're saying the Big East grabbed a school in Nebraska mainly because they last went to the Sweet 16 - which is before the tourny expanded to 64 teams and therefore easier to reach - 30 years before the invite? You don't think Creighton's sustained success for years in the non con and at the top of the Valley was a bigger reason? Why did Dana Altman land a job at Oregon then? Shouldn't they have laughed at him and said sorry Dana, you never made it to the Sweet 16? Yes, those milestones in March Madness are important, but to use that as an argument that Murray "isn't good enough" is an interesting choice.
Like minded institutions: Murray is a pretty like minded institution to the public school template in the Valley. Also, Murray to the Valley is a conference upgrade just like the Valley to the Big East.
The anti Murray argument is fine, but if one goes that route than there literally is not a school out there that is worthy from a basketball perspective at least at the Valley level.or below since programs never downgrade conferences.
You're the one who said they never went to the sweet 16. I Was just pointing out that you weren't correct.. It was actually harder to reach the tourney in 1974 because only 32 conference champions made it in back then. And of course, Creighton's overall success was important to their moving up from the MVC. And regarding that, the Valley has been and is significantly more highly regarded than the OVC. Also, I'm not a Murray Hater, I'm just not sold on the argument that they have to be the one.You obviously did not get the jest of my response. Murray has way less in common with MVC schools than CU(large number of Catholic schools) had with the Big East. CU had no football which eliminated another problem. CU Is a highly rated academic institution...and lastly the one you ignored that may be the biggest reason Murray is on the bubble is tv market size..Omaha is a major market, Murray isn't.....but you didn't address that either. If the only issue was Murrays bball success they'd probably be in....but there is simply more to it than that.
